Waffle Graphics Confusion, Waffles Versus Coins...

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Waffle Graphics Confusion, Waffles Versus Coins...

Postby datahead » 20 Jul 2014 11:38

As discussed at https://github.com/Quintus/SMC/issues/117, the waffle graphics currently look a lot like coins and are being mistaken by some people at first as coins. Other items such as level editor text may also still be making reference to coins.

Thus the current plan is to switch back to coins for release 2.0.

The question is - what should be done going forward?

My thought is that coins hold to the roots of the game more. I would say that some things in the original SMC shouldn't change. For coins, we would ultimately need a signature logo on them (an ancient symbol, an M, or something as long as it's not a mushroom).

The argument for waffles is that a lot of people had thrown their support in when it was discussed several years ago, and it has been in the dev version in some form for a while (not in a release version though). If waffles are reimplemented, the best way may be to generate a new 3D model with a tool such as Blender and generate new rotation sprites from it.

Also, either option used should integrate with the story well, even if it's something like a "waffle plant" or the "coin currency of the ancients".

See also:
* viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3609&hilit=waffles (original waffle discussion started by Crabmaster)
* http://smc.quintilianus.eu/viewtopic.php?id=35 (waffles coins confusion)
* http://smc.quintilianus.eu/viewtopic.php?id=36 (story possibilities for waffles)
* https://github.com/Quintus/SMC/issues/103 (how many graphics should be de-Mario-ized?)
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Re: Waffle Graphics Confusion, Waffles Versus Coins...

Postby Guest_xD » 20 Jul 2014 12:26

Hi

This is somewhat of a general response, not just to the issue with waffles, but I feel it's relevant to many decisions to come.

At some point, there was a general consensus that SMC was "not a mario clone" and so should move away from original mario-type things like turtles, goombas, coins etc etc.

However, all that I've seen being done on this note is the exchange of some graphics.
Gameplay was Mario-esque all the time and no matter how much you change the graphics, this game, to me, still feels like a Mario game, simply due to the mechanics (Krush, Armadillo, Flyon, Thromp, the whole upgrade system, Moons, Rokkos).

If the team decides that SMC should not be a Mario-like game, doing so by implementing twists to enemies and mechanics is most likely a much better idea than just changing graphics, albeit probably requiring more thought and effort in discussion and implementation. I think, before we argue about whether we want Waffles or Coins, Armadillos or Turtles, Furballs or Goombas, we should argue about what interesting platformer ideas we have that we would love to see done in this game, from then move on to designing enemies, physics objects, obstacles, abilities and the likes and from then move on to designing a story for our character(s).

Or we just screw the whole thing and decide we're a Mario clone that simply doesn't want Mario-like graphics (which appears to be the underlying thinking of deciding whether to use Waffles or Coins).

I feel this discussion needs a different starting point and different arguments to do any good for the game, which is why I brought up this meta-discussion here.
If enough people are concerned, maybe this can be moved to its own thread.

Best Regards
...
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Re: Waffle Graphics Confusion, Waffles Versus Coins...

Postby datahead » 21 Jul 2014 00:33

At some point, there was a general consensus that SMC was "not a mario clone" and so should move away from original mario-type things like turtles, goombas, coins etc etc.

There pretty much is a new team now, so the decision is up the in the air again, as you hinted.

My thought is that it's fine to have a game that largely feels like Mario as long as we deviate from it in some respects (maybe adding another move, as you suggested). Implementing radical changes may destroy the feel a lot of people have come to enjoy. SMC basically provides a way to enjoy some of the same fun we enjoyed on Nintendo systems while (ultimately) avoiding copyright infringement and paying out money.

To that point, this is why I like the idea of sticking to the games roots with some things such as coins or tubes that seem like pipes. Also, I don't see any harm in discussing things such as enemies and the story (or its villain) as long as we keep the mechanics/play feel discussion going. As you said, we may need to move this main discussion to another thread; otherwise any thoughts on the original topic will become buried.
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